Reason why should BLS get banned.

First topic message reminder :

Ok so scoopphase and that random boi are dueling, ninjas vs plants

scoopphase 1700 LP
random boi 700 LP

scoopphases field: REDMD pulsar no backrows
hand: 2 cards

random bois field: 1 token no backrows
hand: 1 card

scoop phase ends random boi draws veiler summons it sync formula eff top mind control take pulsar go stardust summons last card in hand BLS

broken shit? anyway this is a good reason for it to get banned and here is a chat between em after bls showed up

Spoiler:

yugioh is bad for health

SirFunchalot wrote:

gorz = generic wins games
mind con = " "
trishula = " "
one for one = " "
brionac = " "
reborn = " " + was previously banned
dark hole = " "
future fusion = not quite as generic but has always enabled OTK plays and sets up graveyard


These are the cards out of the lot I mentioned that definitely need to go to 0. The rest could probably be at 1 and that would be fine.

And would you look at that, all of them are at one. There are some duels where I don't even see a card I run 2 of, 3 of if my luck is bad. Having a single copy of the card in the deck and waiting for it to go for your super-amazing-instant-win combo is ridiculous.

Again, they /can/ win games, but so can so many other cards, and while these do so more often it's still fact that they aren't "use this and you win" in the sense that having and playing the card means you win.

For instance, if I have an empty field and Gorz in hand, no duh you're going to be suspecting Gorz, depending on what deck I play. It's up to the one who can set off the Gorz to:
A. Analyze the situation and see if they have Gorz
B. See if they can handle a Gorz coming down if they go ahead and proceed.
C. Make a decision on how to carry it all out based on the scenario.

If I'm playing a plant Synchro deck, I'm of course going to be wary of an impending Trish/Brio/whatever, especially depending on what's been done so far. Again, it's up to the duelist to handle it accordingly. If you can't, then you need to figure out what you're doing wrong, in whatever aspect of your game, and fix it instead of repeatedly getting sacked by the same card.

Also, if you're so deadset on these cards being broken beyond being able to be reasonably used in peoples' decks, why don't you protest that and not use them in your decks, hm? Otherwise, you'd be a bit of a hypocrite.
I can so foresee a response along the lines of "Well I have to use them, or I'll lose" coming out of this little part here.

One last point: 8 cards that need to be banned right now. /Half/ that number of cards was banned for this list, and before that 3.

hey how about this to turn the tides on dark hole...white hole. huh huh??? anyone? dark hole is mained in alot of decks nowadays, so why not main white hole(rhetorical question, does not need to be answered)? it would be hilarious to see their reaction when you coutner their card with the specific counter

I don't know why you're even saying that in order to not play right into a Gorz you have to be smart about it, I'm assuming both players in the game are of an equal and high skill level. So the chances of them derping and attacking with a Stardust Dragon directly turn one and burning out there resources is impossibly low. What I am saying, is that these cards are generically used, and when drawn, and played in a smart manner, very very very very often lead to a win for the player who played them.

This is not the case for every other good card. Thunder King Rai-Oh, for instance, is not a card that when played will automatically win you the game because of the hole it opens up in your opponents resources or the combo it sets up; it's still a phenomenal card. Dark Hole, when saved for the right moment, WILL open up a huge hole in your opponents resources and enable you to win, that's just what the card does.

In yugioh the goal is to win, as in any game. If I want to win (the goal), and to increase my chances of winning I should run Brionac, Dragon of the Ice Barrier in my Extra Deck, you bet your ass I'm not going to replace him with Gaia Knight the Force of Earth just for coolness points.

I am in no way saying Konami WILL in any likelihood ban all 8 of these cards, I predict probably Mind Control, Monster Reborn, and Brionac getting the boot. Mind Con is way too helpful for Xyz, Monster Reborn has been around long enough and no one can really debate the fact that it's busted, and Brionac is way too good at getting rid of the new Xyz monsters (which konami wants to promote the purchase of). Maybe if we get lucky Future Fusion will get the hit since the new Dragon structure is coming out and Konami doesn't want Dragons to be too ridiculous.

the only ones that i can honestly agree with you about with the new reasoning that you put behind it would be brio, mind control(which wont be too big of a deal when magi magi magician girl comes out), and future fusion for when the structure decks comes. but my deck wont hurt too much cuz i have my own form of brio that i can use so i really dont care if that gets hit, actually i would prefer it too, but i would not bet on it.

Getting you too agree with me on 3/8 is certainly a step in the right direction, although for the life of me I can't understand how you think Dark Hole and Monster Reborn are perfectly fair cards that should be allowed to be played in the advanced format...

Nivedo wrote:

hey how about this to turn the tides on dark hole...white hole. huh huh??? anyone? dark hole is mained in alot of decks nowadays, so why not main white hole(rhetorical question, does not need to be answered)? it would be hilarious to see their reaction when you coutner their card with the specific counter

I now want to make a troll deck full of cards like that. White Hole, Mirror of the Ice Barrier, Call of the Grave...

@Funch: No no, I'm sorry, I'm going to purposely run into a Gorz and lose the game every time I can, because it's fun. And there you go: "when played in a smart manner." So yes, they can be herp-derp cards, but they can be used wrong like any other card, have weaknesses like any other card, can be played around like any other card, etc.

Rai-Oh can almost automatically win you the game in many aspects. He laughs at so many meta decks it's not even funny. And by the way, when saved for the right moment, Rai-Oh or a hundred other cards WILL enable you to win in much the same way. And especially Rai-Oh, as he instantly makes quite a lot of great cards dead and has that great negating ability we all know and love/hate. Dark Hole just does it more directly and short-term.

You have to be smart to use the cards correctly, simple as that. And often, the duelist can't use their Dark Hole or Reborn or whatever because their opponent wins right there on that turn, oh by the way. Not to mention the possibility of a card like Solemn Judgment, Mirror Force, whatever screwing up the play. It's not like every time a Gorz drops, you have no cards other than the monster you attacked with.

I never said coolness points or any of that crap.

EDIT: By the way, putting solid, specific reasoning in your argument is good. Just saying "it wins games" is not.

NotSoGallantGallade wrote:

EDIT: By the way, putting solid, specific reasoning in your argument is good. Just saying "it wins games" is not.

that is the only reason why i agreed with what you had said.
but there are plenty of cards to negate spells, traps, or even both.

the main reason why i had agreed is because konami and yugioh in general are trying to push for exceeds to be the next big thing. such as extra gate for example. so anything that hurts exceeds will probably be hit for a format or 2 until exceeds reach their peek. then they will probably just be brought back

How is a card that very easily directly wins games not sound reasoning? Dark Hole destroys an entire field to set up a push. It's why Raigeki is banned, why Feather Duster/Trunade/Cold Wave are banned, all of these cards simply enable an end game scenario to be reached quickly and easily. No shit all of them can be countered or played around, but the point of the matter is that more often than not they can't be, and that's why they're on the banlist. Dark Hole was banned for that very such reason for years and years, and the way Dark Hole is played hasn't changed at all, it still functions exactly the same and that's why it should go. The same sort of logic goes for Monster Reborn and the like, YES WE KNOW, they can be countered (directly by a solemn or in directly by veiler/maxx c/battlefader/whatever) but the point is that they are so easy to play and when they are played very OFTEN (not all the time) they open up a situation where if your opponent DOES NOT have a way to counter it they lose. Cards that on their own have the power to take a fairly even matchup and instantly flip it not only into your favor but to where you win outright, are broken and should be banned.

the reason for raigeki was there was no risk to hurt your own monsters, which makes it unbalanced, whereas dark hole affects both sides AND has a counter. now then people dont play it as such and use it when they dont have to worry about destroying their monsters. with that logic they can just bring back raigeki and ban dark hole. but that will be more broken cuz then they can clear you freshly swarmed field while you have monsters on your side and attack for game.

there will always be broken cards, you just have to learn to build against such cards. you wont win all the time and you wont lose all the time. if there are game winning cards, then just toss them into your decks and make them work for you instead of against you

You can't build your deck against broken cards (and have it be good), that's why they're so broken, because their effects when they go off are unfairly good. :S

you might not be able to cover all cards, but that is also where your side deck comes in at