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 5 months since i last seriously asked for help on a deck

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Nivedo

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PostSubject: 5 months since i last seriously asked for help on a deck   Sat Mar 03, 2012 6:06 am

well here is a link to the deck from before that i asked for help with.
http://tdga.forumotion.com/t1661-laval-deck
and it still won several duels.

but here is the less defensive, more aggressive build of it that i use now, and would seriously like some help with.

http://imgur.com/og1Ja


the original deck build was to play defensively until i got all the cards i needed. now my current build is to send the cards myself to the grave as fast as possible, but still have the chance to pull out bigger beaters to get over annoying beaters such as king tiger wanghu of tkr. those are main reasons for lancelord and burner, or sometimes i would even use rekindling, the torrential my own field just to get back lady or burner. but the main focus of this build if you couldn't tell would be to get out shooting quasar, but so many times i am stopped one way or another and usually go with a beat down strategy with some of the other laval synchros ad synch with forest sprite last.

anyways enough of a synopsis with the build. the types of fixes that i am looking for would be any traps i might have over looked, i know maxx c is the one way to survive the wind-up loop, so if you can find a place for even one of them that would be nice. (note i want to use this deck irl so keep high expensive cards to a minimum, and suggest the most i should get[for use on DN]).
i dont have too many problems with GKs, i normally get over ran by six sams at times, but one of the problems was trish. but even with sams aside, and im stuck playing defensively, one brio will kill me sometimes because they can attack directly. so i was thinking necro gardna, but once again, cannot personally find a place to fit him in, even though i know he would be a good addition to the deck.
with that aside, what im basically looking for are any improvements on this build. i will probably be a bit sketchy about changing anything in the extra deck, so if you say to change anything in there, you better give a GOOD REASON as to why i should change it out. also i would like it if (and i know what i say probably wont hold too much ground) anyone on this forum or people who come to this site would refrain from copying this deck. besides there are soo many other sacky decks out there like wind-ups or inzectors, or anything else like the such.

well guys im open to most changes, and anything that will help make the deck run faster
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SirFunchalot

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PostSubject: Re: 5 months since i last seriously asked for help on a deck   Sat Mar 03, 2012 7:38 am

When running Lavals there is pretty much only 1 reason to even run them and that is because they can easily play Shooting Quasar Dragon, a card that pretty much instantly wins the game. The way this is most commonly achieved is through the usage of Sweltering Heat Transmission Field + Rekindling. You use SHTF to send Laval Volcano Handmaiden and Laval Magma Cannoneer / Laval Cannon, then use LVH to send 2 other copies of herself to the Graveyard and another Cannoner/Cannon. The next step is obviously using Rekindling to bring all 5 monsters back. You bring it all back, use 1 LVH and a Cannon(eer) to make T.G. Hyper Librarian, then another LVH and Cannon(eer) to drop a Lavalval Dragon and draw 1 card. Then you either Special Summon Boost Warrior from your hand or Normal Summon Flamvel Poun and synchro with the third LVH for Formula Synchron, drawing 2 cards, then finally drop the Quasar. This is hands down the most powerful play the deck can possibly make, so achieving this game-state should be the main focus of the deck.

The following build maximizes the potential for this combo and the Red Nova Dragon Combo which also involves SHTF and Rekindling to go off. You simply drop Laval Lancelord and LVH (then 2 more LVH and Laval Lady of the Burning Lake). Drop Rekindling to bring all 5 back. Synchro with LVH and Lancelord for a lv7 (probably Black Rose Dragon since it's the best LV7 synchro and is versatile enough to warrant the Extra Deck slot for reasons other than this) then synchro with it and the 2nd LVH for Red Dragon Archfiend, then finally synchro RDA LVH and LLotBL for Red Nova Dragon. In conjunction with the 3 new uses of LVH you can have a possible 6 tuner monsters in the Graveyard, setting RDA at a very nice 6500 attack, but probably you'll use the LLotBL at least once to pop some card to help clear the way for an attack.

Monsters:24
3 Boost Warrior
3 Flamvell Poun
3 Flamvell Firedog
3 Maxx "C"
3 Laval Volcano Handmaiden
3 Laval Magma Cannoneer
2 Laval Lady of the Burning Lake
1 Laval Coatl
1 Laval Lancelord
1 Flamvell Magician
1 Laval Cannon

Spells:16
3 Pot of Duality
3 Sweltering Heat Transmission Field
3 Rekindling
3 Mystical Space Typhoon
1 Heavy Storm
1 Monster Reborn
1 Dark Hole
1 Mind Control

Extra Deck:15
1 Shooting Quasar Dragon
1 Red Nova Dragon
1 Shooting Star Dragon
1 Mist Wurm
1 Red Dragon Archfiend
1 Stardust Dragon
1 Scrap Dragon / Ally of Justice Catastor (depends on which card you feel you need more, but both are great)
1 Black Rose Dragon
1 Brionac, Dragon of the Ice Barrier
1 T.G. Hyper Librarian
1 Lavalval Dragon
1 Armory Arm
1 T.G. Recipro Dragonfly
1 Formula Synchron
1 Daigusto Emeral

You might realize there are some synchros that you wouldn't normally run and I will explain why.

T.G. Recipro Dragonfly + Scrap Dragon/Red Dragon Archfiend/Stardust Dragon + Formula Synchron = Shooting Quasar Dragon

Armory Arm + Brionac, Dragon of the Ice Barrier + Formula Synchron = Shooting Quasar Dragon

The reasons why the other laval and flamvell synchros aren't in the Extra Deck is simple, they are terrible cards, and while they might win games against DN scrubs, they really truly are outclassed by the other cards already in the Extra Deck.

One issue I can see you having with this deck is the obvious total lack of defensive traps, and the reason for that is they really slow down the deck a lot by dropping the consistency of the Quasar/RND combos. This is why you should side deck the solemns and torrentials and fiendish chains for the slower grindier matchups where your opponent is running a control deck and you need to be able to counter their slower plays, but when up against a deck like Wind-Ups if you can avoid being looped and have an MST or LLotBL ready to pop their back row, you can usually go off and win the game without too much of a worry also if you bluff by setting things like Pot of Duality you can usually get them to think twice about going off recklessly anyway.
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Nivedo

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PostSubject: Re: 5 months since i last seriously asked for help on a deck   Sat Mar 03, 2012 8:15 am

Ok first off, like i said i have been running lavals for almost this entire past format. Second i know that quasar is the biggest play in the deck, but guess what, just about everyone else knows that as well and will do what they can to stop it. Second with 3 shtf there will be dead draws, i know this because sometimes at 2 1 is a dead draw. 3 i will not run mist worm for the same reason i didnt run trish. You can find the reason in an earlier version of my deck. And lastly i already specifies the help that i am looking for. Im not looking for a new deck per say, im looking for enhancments to help fight against the mentioned decks
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SirFunchalot

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PostSubject: Re: 5 months since i last seriously asked for help on a deck   Sat Mar 03, 2012 8:39 am

1. Regardless of how long you've been running the deck doesn't mean your version is the best.
2. Unless they have a solemn or other defensive trap that gets rid of monsters or a Rai-Oh, they can't stop it. Maxx "C" and Veiler do not stop the drop of Quasar.
3. Dead draws don't mean anything when you have a Quasar out since he WINS YOU THE GAME. The reason you run 3 is because of CONSISTENCY. You need to draw your combo pieces as fast as possible or you LOSE.
4. You run Mist Wurm because he's a fantastic level 9 synchro. This gives diversity to the amount of plays you can make and maximizes the potential of your Extra Deck. Mist Wurm opens up huge pushes for game and while granted he isn't as good as Trishula he's still fantastic. Run him, because he's WAY better than most other cards you could run in his place.
5. I'm not giving you a new deck at all, this is still Lavals, it just has its strategy far more focused than your builds was. By adding multiple copies of necessary combo pieces the only thing I've done is increase the likelihood of you going off and dropping your game winning Synchros.
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Harper7000
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PostSubject: Re: 5 months since i last seriously asked for help on a deck   Sat Mar 03, 2012 9:30 am

SirFunchalot wrote:
1. Regardless of how long you've been running the deck doesn't mean your version is the best.
2. Unless they have a solemn or other defensive trap that gets rid of monsters or a Rai-Oh, they can't stop it. Maxx "C" and Veiler do not stop the drop of Quasar.
3. Dead draws don't mean anything when you have a Quasar out since he WINS YOU THE GAME. The reason you run 3 is because of CONSISTENCY. You need to draw your combo pieces as fast as possible or you LOSE.
4. You run Mist Wurm because he's a fantastic level 9 synchro. This gives diversity to the amount of plays you can make and maximizes the potential of your Extra Deck. Mist Wurm opens up huge pushes for game and while granted he isn't as good as Trishula he's still fantastic. Run him, because he's WAY better than most other cards you could run in his place.
5. I'm not giving you a new deck at all, this is still Lavals, it just has its strategy far more focused than your builds was. By adding multiple copies of necessary combo pieces the only thing I've done is increase the likelihood of you going off and dropping your game winning Synchros.

I agree with everything here.

1. Yep
2. It may seem like a reckless way to play, but Lavals aren't a control deck for sure. You run 3 mst, heavy, and 2 ladies. it's all good...usually
3. 3 Sweltering is a staple bc you NEED to draw it. If you draw it, there is no late game usually to be able to dead draw anything else
4. Why the hell didn't you run Trish? She wins games nearly as effectively as Quasar at times. Your extra deck is for options, not to chuck random synchros with Laval in the name
5. Exactly and you said you were open to changes. It would be nice to have a few traps but idk what you would cut.

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PostSubject: Re: 5 months since i last seriously asked for help on a deck   Mon Apr 02, 2012 4:51 pm

Laval Dual slasher is not needed at all. He used to be good because of rekindling bait but since the format has changed he is not nessasary. I would at most run him at 1 because you can syc and then go into larger sycros and rekindling him. Personally i would run a second stennon over black rose a few reasons but the main one being cost. I would either run boost warrior at 3 or battle fader at 3. I could see both being used effectivly however since you are trying a more aggro build boost would be your best bet. You need to add a red nova dragon and a shooting star dragon as well. I would take out one dual slasher and lavalval dragon. Red nova and shooting star are easy to make and quite cheap. They also will give you alot of options if you are unable to get out quesar so your deck doesn't fall apart.
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SirFunchalot

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PostSubject: Re: 5 months since i last seriously asked for help on a deck   Mon Apr 02, 2012 7:02 pm

Please try not to revive month old threads whenever possible, I know you're new here and possibly to forums in general, but necroposting as it is called, is a generally looked down upon practice. Also it seems that the poster of this thread has been quite unactive since this was even put up so I doubt any suggestions will even be read, let alone listened to.
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Nivedo

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PostSubject: Re: 5 months since i last seriously asked for help on a deck   Mon Apr 02, 2012 7:58 pm

inactivity in posting doesnt mean that i dont check back here often enough for me to appreciate a necropost that i find as helpful. i just want to set the record straight on that.

from what i have read in your post anti-meta, it seems like you more or less understand where im trying to get with the deck. but i have a few questions for you.
for the 2 extra boost warriors, what you say i should take out in place of the boost warriors, and any reason why?
in the picture i was thinking that i could possibly take out the two cards that are at the end of the list in place of boost warrior, especially car card d, since i was just playing around with him. useful at times, but havent quite found any great importance in having him in there.
also i took out crimson blader since hes good against synchro decks, and decks that focus around high level monsters, and given the format, its only good for a side deck choice, so i ended up switching him out for shooting star. but now the question is, between greater or dual slahser, who should be replaced with red nova. greater is good vs inzectors, so i wouldnt want to get rid of him, but im also quite fond of dual slasher.

also not sure if i mentioned in my original post or not, but i am meaning for this to be a deck that can be built for less than 30 dollars atm, as in it wont cost more than $30 to get the cards that i dont have. there are a few exceptions to this requirement, and that is if i can get ahold of one or not by tournament day.

anyways its nice to get some help that doesnt sound like,"go with the meta it always wins games" or " meta wins games so you should do what everyone else does and use meta cards".

one of the cards that were always suggested to me was trish, and i always turned it down for several reasons, attainability, personal preference, timing in a duel, etc...

anyways thanks for your sgesstions, i might not use them right away unless you give me a good reason to use it, as in the advantages that i cant argue against, or that i can agree with
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PostSubject: Re: 5 months since i last seriously asked for help on a deck   Tue Apr 03, 2012 4:00 am

Simply boost is needed at 3 because you do not want to wait forever for your big sycros. This deck is great but its win condition is the high level syncros especally shooting star. I never really preferred card car D especally in a deck that hinges around syncros and special summoning so i would probably suggest taking that out as well as one laval lancelord. The reason for lancelord is because he is useful but often situational and you can still pull off any combos you need without him at 2. For the red nova dragon i would take out a dual slasher. I know you like him but think of it this way. You only need one just in case it is your most viable option while waiting for rekindling for larger plays. If he dies you can rekindling him again so you dont really loose him if he dies. Hope this helps you make your decisions. And in the future i will not revive old threads.
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Nivedo

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PostSubject: Re: 5 months since i last seriously asked for help on a deck   Tue Apr 03, 2012 4:30 am

i will go ahead and playtest it with the changes you have suggested and i will see how it works out for me
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PostSubject: Re: 5 months since i last seriously asked for help on a deck   Tue Apr 03, 2012 1:56 pm

let me know how it goes
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Nivedo

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PostSubject: Re: 5 months since i last seriously asked for help on a deck   Wed Apr 04, 2012 1:40 am

my first test run with it went well. just a couple of things.

adding in red nova turned out great i beat dark worlds due to it. but a couple things i saw that might be a bit of a problem is that i like to use laval lady's effect, and with her being one of the main pieces for red nova, i would need to either add one more lady or 2 more sprites. and adding one more lady would be much easier. also one lancelord is workable and do-able but i having 2 is still something i would like to have.

so any ideas about how to get a third laval lady in the deck. and possibly a second lancelord. i have only done one playtest so im not completely sure about the changes im asking for, these are just things i might need changed
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PostSubject: Re: 5 months since i last seriously asked for help on a deck   Wed Apr 04, 2012 1:18 pm

I would just take out one burner, one magma cannoneer, and the gold sarc for 3 laval cannoneers. Gold sarc is good but with 3 boosts it might slow it down a bit.
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PostSubject: Re: 5 months since i last seriously asked for help on a deck   Thu Apr 05, 2012 12:44 am

i want to keep the two magma cannoneers in there just because of the fact that(like stated earlier in the post) the strongest first turn play, and one of the strongest plays for the deck is shooting quasar. if i take out magma cannoneer then that will make it to where it is nearly impossible(it would make the chances almost as low as getting exodia without playing anything) to first turn shooting quasar. i wouldnt mind taking out gold sarc for a cannoneer, but burner is a beat stick that i can special summon mid-late game, and is normally a target for laval lady when he is in the grave. that normally helps sets up for a bigger and stronger play when i use return from the different dimension.

that being said running just 1 cannoneer, it doesnt seem like i would be able to make good use of it. so please back up what you are suggesting with some good reasoning, or suggest different cards to switch out.

the only reason i ask for a reason for a switch is because i have been playing lavals for a little half a year now and im pretty set on my current build right now, but i also know that there are some things that could be changed to make it better, but not sure what, and not sure what i would take out either

EDIT:
ALSO after a few test duels against bad matchups for me, i would either need to know some side deck options, or some main deck options for when i go against any deck that likes to abuse naturia beast. that is the main killer of my deck, especially so if i were to go with some of the original statements. if i didnt say it in the original post then my main goal for the final make of this deck is to be able to use it on DN as well as IRL for tournaments, and i am pretty poor compared to a majority of tournament players. so any cards added i must be able to get access to. or already own, or can cheaply get.
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